Delrin 8-key suggestions/opinions?

[MadmanWithaWhistle]

So I've recently joined a band with some of the old Seattle Scots/Irish crowd, and while my keyless flute is fine for standard Irish tunes at a standard session, we do a significant amount of singing in various keys with wind accompaniment. I'm interested in getting a keyed flute, likely in Delrin for durability, with particular emphasis on the low Cnat key. We play a bunch of Scottish stuff, so having an actually usable and graceful flat 7th is important.

I'm not interested in getting into the wood/delrin debate, as I've found embouchure design has a greater influence on the tone than material. Dave Copley makes 8-key flutes out of delrin, and I wondered whether anyone had experience with his keywork and embouchure cuts. Would they be could enough to warrant ordering an 8-key? I'm looking for honest opinions, not the faint praise I usually see in these threads. Feel free to PM me if you're not comfortable discussing your experiences in an open forum.

Much appreciated!
CS

[Peter Duggan]

Well, I don't actually have an 8-key, but...

I've got both wood (custom 4-key) and Delrin (keyless) Copleys and tried Dave's low C and C# keys when he was over here before personally deciding against them. The reason being nothing to do with the quality of the keywork (which is excellent, and as much Marlene's as Dave's), but the positioning of those old-style articulated keys, which end up pretty well out of reach with the foot joint rotated how I like it to keep the Eb key high. For that reason I'd be looking for Boehm-style foot keys if I wanted these notes.

The embouchures (elliptical in both cases) are excellent, but subtly different enough* to reward constant play on one flute or the other, with the one getting the most time usually sounding the better and a few minutes' adjustment sometimes necessary to match the sound when swapping over. While they've got the reputation of being easy players and that's certainly true in terms of getting an acceptable sound, I'd say they also repay sustained work to really develop the tone and I'm still discovering new depths and consistency to mine a couple of years down the line.

*I'm guessing between any two nominally identical flutes and not just mine.

PS (edited):

I'm looking for honest opinions, not the faint praise I usually see in these threads.

No faint praise here. I wouldn't swap mine for anything!

[tompipes]

Here's a thought.

Have you considered going the other direction and having Dave make you a 6 keyed C flute so you could play in D.
It'd be like playing an E maj scale on a D flute. Not difficult at all and you're really only using 2 keys.

I'd guess a 6 keyed C flute would be a bit cheaper than an 8 keyed D flute too.

Tommy

[MadmanWithaWhistle]

Here's a thought.

Have you considered going the other direction and having Dave make you a 6 keyed C flute so you could play in D.
It'd be like playing an E maj scale on a D flute. Not difficult at all and you're really only using 2 keys.

I'd guess a 6 keyed C flute would be a bit cheaper than an 8 keyed D flute too.

Tommy

I really don't fancy re-learning all my D tunes when all I really need is the ability to play a flat 7th now and again. Plus, much of the appeal of certain tunes is where they fall on a D flute fingering.

[Jayhawk]

Michael Cronnolly used to make 8 keyed R&R flutes. The low C is great on mine. You could email him to see if he'd make one special order. Or, maybe you could find one used.

Eric

[Caspermilktoast]

I have a 6 key Copley flute made of Mopane wood. I have owned some very nice flutes and I have to say that Daves are really great. You really cant go wrong with it. I don't think I would ever sell mine, definitely a keeper. All the keys work great and the flute can be played very loud if needed. Dave is also a really great guy and a pleasure doing business with, great communicator and he had the job done in the time frame he quoted . I say go for it. Feel free to PM me with any particular question.

[ancientfifer]

I recently tried a Francois Baubet Delrin keyless D Rudall style, medium hole, and it was a crackin' flute. If available with keys, would be a super flute.

[Lars Larry Mór Mott]

I recently tried a Francois Baubet Delrin keyless D Rudall style, medium hole, and it was a crackin' flute. If available with keys, would be a super flute.

It is! Both a cracking flute and available with keys, that is

[Peter Duggan]

It is! Both a cracking flute and available with keys, that is

With eight keys? When Baubet says 'I can add up to 6 keys ( long C, Bb, G#, long F, short F and Eb).'

[Lars Larry Mór Mott]

It is! Both a cracking flute and available with keys, that is

With eight keys? When Baubet says 'I can add up to 6 keys ( long C, Bb, G#, long F, short F and Eb).'

No, sorry.. responded to post above mine instead of OP. You're right Peter.

[dunnp]

I think Glen LeBot in France would make a Delrin 8 key as well.

He might even do something cool like a white delrin flute with bronze keys.

Another thing to consider is that in today's antique market you might find an ebonite Hawkes type flute for less than a new flute.

[tin tin]

I've had my six-key Copley for a decade now, and I'm delighted with it: excellent intonation, quality keywork, and a rich, strong tone. A couple of years ago (this is a mortifying story), I nicked the edge of the embouchure hole and then tried to 'fix' it. After much weeping and gnashing of teeth, I ended up sending it in to Dave for repair, and he installed a mother of pearl edge. It came back better than before, so Dave's got some good embouchure cutting mojo happening.
Some years ago, I had the chance to try the elliptical and modern cuts side by side. I preferred the elliptical (perhaps because I was more used to it); it seemed maybe a bit sweeter and a bit easier to focus. (Although I recall the low D being a bit easier to hit with the rectangular cut.) But that's with my lips. The ideal would be to be able to try both and see what floats your boat.