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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:28 am 
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s1m0n wrote:
... Ezekiel's 'wheel within a wheel'...
which is enough to find some text to go with the image. Very apt, Dr Phil :)


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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:47 pm 
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david_h wrote:
s1m0n wrote:
... Ezekiel's 'wheel within a wheel'...
which is enough to find some text to go with the image. Very apt, Dr Phil :)


Thank you.

But, being dumb, I am not sure why it is apt. I was playing off the flat-earth thing and raising awareness of Flammarion's delightful woodcut. I do not mind being 'apt' - in fact I am reveling in it. But if I can figure out the trick I might manage again sometime...... :D

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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:38 pm 
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DrPhill wrote:
But, being dumb, I am not sure why it is apt...
Simply that, as I think you intended, it plays off the shenanigans at Bedford Level very well. What Google found me was:

"A naïve missionary of the Middle Ages even tells us that, in one of his voyages in search of the terrestrial paradise, he reached the horizon where the earth and the heavens met, and that he discovered a certain point where they were not joined together, and where, by stooping his shoulders, he passed under the roof of the heavens." Camille Flammarion, L’atmosphère: météorologie populaire, 1888." https://newgottland.com/2012/02/08/more ... in-wheels/

By the mid 19th century (though I have not looked up when) surveyors and navigators had a lot of experience of atmospheric refraction, such that they could probably pick a day and time when there was, or was not, likely to be an inversion that made the earth look flat. I guess opposing experts trying to convince a court would have had the lawyers laughing their way to the bank.


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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:35 pm 
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OK, thanks. I thought I had accidentally been more clever.

But you are right about my intent. It irritates me that we can say on one day 'the atmospheric conditions are just wrong so the experiment does not tell the truth' and on another day 'these are the right conditions, see it proves our case'. I would be tempted to dismiss both as equally unreliable.

Happened in school too, when measuring the acceleration due to gravity. All of our results 'tended to the low side'. So we picked the highest because, as the teacher explained, 'it was the one least affected by friction'. I learned an important lesson that day, but not the one on the syllabus.

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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:59 pm 
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david_h wrote:
"A naïve missionary of the Middle Ages even tells us that, in one of his voyages in search of the terrestrial paradise, he reached the horizon where the earth and the heavens met, and that he discovered a certain point where they were not joined together, and where, by stooping his shoulders, he passed under the roof of the heavens."

Hey, bartender? I'll have what he's having.

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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:01 pm 
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Nanohedron wrote:
Hey, bartender? I'll have what he's having.

A large religious experience? With a slice of doubt, sir?

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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:02 pm 
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DrPhill wrote:
I would be tempted to dismiss both as equally unreliable.
They probably both give good estimates of refraction at the time of the experiments. By that time the curvature of the earth was known to a hight degree of precision. Something like Bedford Level would be ideal for demonstrating the changes in refraction of light.


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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:10 pm 
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david_h wrote:
DrPhill wrote:
I would be tempted to dismiss both as equally unreliable.
They probably both give good estimates of refraction at the time of the experiments. By that time the curvature of the earth was known to a hight degree of precision. Something like Bedford Level would be ideal for demonstrating the changes in refraction of light.


Nice idea. Point it the other direction and show how some 'evidence' can be misleading, or how badly constructed 'scientific experiments' can give misleading results. That would make an interesting science lesson. I still want the earth to be flat though. Just to get back at the know-it-alls.

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 Post subject: Re: In the news
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:32 pm 
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DrPhill wrote:
Nanohedron wrote:
Hey, bartender? I'll have what he's having.

A large religious experience? With a slice of doubt, sir?

Nah, just pour me a slug o' them special effects. :party:

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