Kerry Optima review

[Dulcimer Bill]

So I had a chance today to check out the Optima. One thing I've learned playing mountain dulcimers over the years is if your trying a new one, you have to get your mind away from the sound of the one you are used to. So when I started to play the Optima, I took the same track. Not to compare yet with what I have but how this one plays to me. I may not describe things well but hopefully you "whistle heads" can help me. First thought was the bell note. We dulcimer players live quite a bit around the bell note. Our strings are tuned Dad. Granted, this whistle is new to me, but I had to "search" for the right air to get it loud but not jump to the second octave. That could come with practice, but volume was low. Next is the second octive G and A. It's like I'm hearing a harmonic? If that's the right term. I hear my note but an underlying second note. Maybe same note lower octive? Breath control doesn't help. Im not looking for a whistle to play by myself. I'm very active in my dulcimer group and we play out quite a bit. So, tomorrow I'll get my others out and compare. I don't have an extensive set. A fairly new Susato, a 2004 Chieftan V3, a Tony Dixon ( older I'm sure, no model number) and a Becker PVC. So more to follow.

[Dulcimer Bill]

I've sent the whistle on to the next person. After playing the Optima again, I guess it's not my cup of tea. Susato is the loudest, but not a big fan of the sound. Dixon, I love everything about it but the bell not. Almost have to whisper. I like the V3 but it is not tunable. When paying out in our group I don't have the time to warm it up, it's bell note is pretty strong. For the Becker..fun easy starter whistle but it takes a lot of air. Breath is not an issue for me. Walk/hike in winter and an avid cyclist in summer. (side note...try a recumbent trike..awsome ride). So for someone who likes to play for themselves, it's a good whistle. Waiting for the V4. And thanks to retired and Phil for putting this out there. U

[pancelticpiper]

One thing I've learned playing mountain dulcimers over the years is if your trying a new one, you have to get your mind away from the sound of the one you are used to.

That is very interesting to me! A refreshing way to do things. Step back and listen to an instrument like it's your first.

The moment I get my hands on a whistle I want to find out how it stacks up against what I'm currently using. It's that quest for the perfect whistle (hopeless I know). So I'm obsessively comparing.

I once did your approach, only once, and it was with Highland pipes. I took the plunge on a new set from a maker I had no experience with. I also got, with the new pipes, a type of bag I'd not used before and a make of drone reeds I'd not used before. (Highland pipes are a complex system of systems and it's rare for a player to change more than one element at the same time.) Like you, I wanted a completely fresh approach, as if this were my first set of pipes. My entirely new setup didn't last! Within a year I had switched reeds and bag and got to a sound and performance more 'normal' for me, and around five years later I sold the set itself, when an amazing 100 year old set fell into my lap.

We dulcimer players live quite a bit around the bell note. Our strings are tuned Dad.

That's a very old, traditional aspect of Irish fluteplaying and it can transfer to low whistles. There was a great quote- can't remember from whom- about the fluteplayers in his area of Ireland back in the 1930s, about "all the music coming up from Bottom D" and being able to hear those powerful booming Bottom Ds across the bay.

I played flute for many years and I cherish a strong Bottom D. Ideally Bottom D should be the strongest note and be capable of being "pushed" very strongly without breaking.

Perhaps the best Low D whistle in this regard is the Burke "Pro Viper". It's a fantastic overall whistle with butter-smooth voicing across the range and great tuning and good volume. And that Bottom D is to die for! The drawback is air consumption, and in addition some people find the tone too pure, uninteresting or bland.

Reyburns and Goldies also have powerful Bottom Ds. I think that one of those three would be your answer.

the second octave G and A. I hear my note but an underlying second note. Maybe same note lower octave?

You have a good ear! That's probably exactly what you're hearing, the presence of the low octave. Many people like that sound, a complex dirty sound. Others want a pure 2nd octave.

You can hear a more striking and clear version of this by playing up in the 4th register, most easily done on D, E, and F#. If you hit it just right it's a multiphonic with the 4th register (the tonic) and the 3rd register (the 5th) sounding simultaneously, and you're playing in parallel 5ths. Sounds cool, and is a staple of jazz fluteplayers like Roland Kirk.

I'm awaiting the Kerry Optima's arrival so I can hear this for myself.

[retired]

Hello All -I'd like to encourage the whistle tour participants to write up their experience / opinion of the tour whistles after playing them. I believe the feedback would be helpful / thought provoking for the manufacturers and other C &F members - regards - Patrick.

[Sirchronique]

Okay, I have received the optima some time ago, and now it is heading your way, Dusty! Sorry for a bit of delay in sending it off, we had some winter weather that absolutely restricted me from being able to get to the post office, as the roads here don't get scraped too well and were a sheet of ice! I expect you'll receive it anytime now, so keep a look out!


Anyway, a review! I was pleasantly surprised by this whistle, as I wasn't expecting to be so pleased with it.

When I first opened the tube I realized this is an ugly whistle. I don't understand the appeal of bright carnival colored red, but, I guess that's not important really. There are is an option to choose whether you want black, or also a different putrid color besides red, if you buy one.

The whistle really delivers well in the tone department. I haven't had a goldie for awhile now, but as far as I can recall (without comparing side-by-side), this sounds very much like a Goldie, if not nearly exactly the same. For someone wanting that Goldie sort of sound in a cheap whistle, this one delivers in that aspect. I disagree with the person who said it was a quiet whistle. I'd say it's at about what I would consider an average volume. Not loud, but not quiet either.

It responds very well to ornamentation, and also it uses very little air, which are two things I really enjoyed about it. As someone who has spent more time playing low D's that use a lot of air, I found myself having to take breaths a lot less frequently than I sometimes have had to, which is always a nice thing. I primarily play reels, jigs, etc. on whistle, so it was nice to be able to go awhile on a breath of air, and also nice that ornaments were nice and snappy.

I just skimmed over this thread, and I think I am not the only one who didn't really like how it was a little bit weak on the bottom, and a bit hard on top. I have no problem with a whistle taking a good push in the top end, nor do I have a problem with a whistle requiring one to be a bit gentle in the bottom end. However, I usually expect a whistle with a hard top end to have a strong bottom end, or a whistle with a weaker bottom end to have a nice sweet high end that doesn't take a hard shove. There are also low whistles like the Burke which I consider to be about average in the top (rather than hard), with a super strong low end, and that's something I really, really like...

However, if a whistle is weak in the bottom and hard in the top, that's something that I think should be improved. The first day I had the Optima I was somewhat put off by this, as it's the only whistle I've played that had the bottom and the top at opposite ends of the spectrum. However, the next day it was bothering me less. After that point, I didn't have to pay much attention to it and my breath adjusted itself to the whistle automatically. So, it's just a matter of getting used to it. However, even though it ceased causing me any problems after the first day, I still think it would be better if it had perhaps a stronger low end so it would match up with the playability in the higher notes, or maybe even vice-versa.. but, it would be nice to have both ends in balance with each other. This goes beyond just my preferences regarding playability, as it causes an even greater difference between audibility of both ends than there is already expected to be on a low whistle. So, this is something that could use improvement.

So, it's a wacky looking whistle that sounds very nice, uses little air, and is quite responsive, but it has some quirkiness in the top and bottom notes. For it's price range, I think it's a great choice, though. I won't be buying one because I wasn't more pleased with it than I am with my current favourites, which, since I started playing almost solely on flute, have shifted from Reviol and Lambe, back to Burke and MK again in the recent past. Right before the tour started (and during the tour) the only low whistles I was playing on were an MK low F and Burke low E, and flute, just to give an idea of where my mind was and what I was accustomed to at the time of the review.

However, if someone is buying a first low D whistle and wants something with that very familiar goldie-esque sort of sound, I'd say don't hesitate to try one out, as it has that sound. At 100$, that puts it in close to the same price range as Susatos and Dixons, and in my opinion it's loads better of a whistle, and something that I think one could use for years and be satisfied with until they are ready to move on to a more fancy whistle. Of course I think Goldies, MKs, or Burke are far better, but they also cost over 3x as much. This is a good cheap alternative that isn't a piece of garbage or one that one will be wanting to move on from in a short period of time, and it has many good qualities. It would be a good first low D, or low D for someone on a budget that wants something that sounds nice. In such a situation, I'd recommend it! You can certainly do worse than the Optima. Just make sure to give it the time to get adjusted to how it plays.

[ubizmo]

When I first opened the tube I realized this is an ugly whistle. I don't understand the appeal of bright carnival colored red, but, I guess that's not important really. There are is an option to choose whether you want black, or also a different putrid color besides red, if you buy one.

I have the blue, which is still on sale, though not as cheap as it was when I bought mine. I don't think it looks too bad, myself.

However, if a whistle is weak in the bottom and hard in the top, that's something that I think should be improved. The first day I had the Optima I was somewhat put off by this, as it's the only whistle I've played that had the bottom and the top at opposite ends of the spectrum. However, the next day it was bothering me less. After that point, I didn't have to pay much attention to it and my breath adjusted itself to the whistle automatically. So, it's just a matter of getting used to it. However, even though it ceased causing me any problems after the first day, I still think it would be better if it had perhaps a stronger low end so it would match up with the playability in the higher notes, or maybe even vice-versa.. but, it would be nice to have both ends in balance with each other. This goes beyond just my preferences regarding playability, as it causes an even greater difference between audibility of both ends than there is already expected to be on a low whistle. So, this is something that could use improvement.

I agree with pretty much everything you've said here. As I pointed out earlier in the thread, after a day or two the top end seems to get easier, but there is a definite discontinuity when you play above high A. I've been playing the Optima to the exclusion of other low whistles for some weeks now.

Concerning the somewhat weak low D and E, I wonder if it's a result of Phil adjusting the size and position of the tone holes to make for an easier reach for beginners. Maybe a whistle maker could comment on this.

[dspmusik]

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[retired]

Dusty - the tour whistle you've been playing is the Optima - it's the same as your Optima whistle. The V-4 is a different whistle that's just finished touring in the west and is now headed to the east. You'll probably get it in a few weeks.

[dspmusik]

Gotcha. I signed up for the v4 tour, don't know how I got on the optima tour, oh well. I deleted the video, don't want to further add to the confusion!

[Sirchronique]

Gotcha. I signed up for the v4 tour, don't know how I got on the optima tour, oh well. I deleted the video, don't want to further add to the conclusion!

I commented on your video and explained why you got the optima.

It was decided that an optima would be included on the tour as well. The two whistles were sent separately and started in different locations, which is why you got it.

[greenspiderweb]

When I first opened the tube I realized this is an ugly whistle. I don't understand the appeal of bright carnival colored red, but, I guess that's not important really. There are is an option to choose whether you want black, or also a different putrid color besides red, if you buy one.

I have the blue, which is still on sale, though not as cheap as it was when I bought mine. I don't think it looks too bad, myself...

...Concerning the somewhat weak low D and E, I wonder if it's a result of Phil adjusting the size and position of the tone holes to make for an easier reach for beginners. Maybe a whistle maker could comment on this.

Yes, right, not important since you get to choose your color, and they aren't all as bright as the red. My blue one is great looking, if you like transparent blue. If you don't like colors, then choose black, or clear! No doubt there are those who will even love the red! It's not often that there is a choice, so be grateful for that at least. I love the brushed finish on the aluminum tube-it glistens in the light, but it's not like a high polish glare, but rather a glow. Very tasteful, I'd say, especially with the transparent blue top!

Anyway, about the Low D and E being weaker, UB-for the overall volume of the whistle (in the low octave that is), I thought the D and E were pretty good on mine-I'm happy they are that strong. Maybe not session strong-since those are the two lowest and hardest always to hear on any whistle (there are a few exceptions), in a noisy environment. But plenty of power for playing at home alone on those notes, and being expressive too. But generally speaking, yes, you're right-if a whistle is easier to play up into the 2nd octave, then the lower notes won't be as strong.

I like how easily it plays-not much work involved in playing the Optima, and still it delivers a nice tone and response as well. If you put a little work into it, it will become more expressive as well. I'm happy to have mine, I know!

[stanton135]

Okay, here goes my review of the Optima. First, I'd like to thank Phil Hardy and retired for getting the whistle into our hands to test drive. Thanks!

I've made a couple of recordings of me playing the Optima, which you can compare to recordings of me playing various other whistles. The low D that I play regularly is the MK Pro, so I'll make some comparisons between the two.

https://app.box.com/s/h0mga65i0tebv9fswch6

I've heard remarks about how the Optima is a well-made, well designed budget instrument, intended as a first low D for people who are used to playing high whistles. My own observations completely agree with this. The first impression I had when playing it was of ease. The whistle is effortless to play, with nearly no backpressure, AND a smallish air requirement—an unusual accomplishment in a low D! It makes this whistle play more like a high whistle than any other low D I've tried. In appearance, this whistle is a cross between the classic Overton design and the familiar look of the cheapie high whistles—Generation, Feadóg, Oak, Walton, with their metal shafts and plastic mouthpieces. In terms of tone, the Optima seems to strike a balance between the classic Overton sound and the whistley breathiness of a Walton, or a Clarke Sweetone. Volume is moderate.

The hole sizings and spacings line up almost exactly to those on my MK, so sealing them with piper's grip was no problem. The Optima's tube ends about 1mm further from the B3 hole than the MK's tube, and I found that I didn't have to worry as much about going easy on the Ds to keep them from going sharp. I ended up opening the tuning slide around 4-5mm to find concert pitch.

I'm pleased with the scale on the Optima. It's tuned to equal temperament, and in the lower octave, there isn't any note that needs to be pushed up or pulled down particularly. The low E and low D break into the second register if they're pushed too hard; however, they don't seem terribly weaker than the other notes in the lower octave. (On the MK, the low E and low D can be pushed a bit more before they break, but doing this can make them go sharp.) I like the C#/Cnat compromise on this whistle. Cnat is in tune at a pressure between B and middle D using OXX OOO, and C# is just 10 or 12 cents flat of ET at that same pressure. A little bit of a push brings it up to ET, if necessary. 12 cents flat is where C# is supposed to be in just intonation on D, anyway. Most low Ds I've tried have had a significantly flatter C#.

I'd say that the Optima has the registers tuned fairly wide. To bring the octaves into tune, I've needed to blow the lower register notes fairly strongly and back off on the higher register. (Of course, "strongly" is a relative term.) In particular, I had to remember to go a little bit easy on high G and middle D to keep them at pitch. These are things I'm sure would become automatic with more familiarity with the instrument. High A speaks clearly and at pitch at a comfortable pressure. However, when I go higher up the instrument's range, the second register gets airy, unfocused, and unstable, and the tuning goes sharp. High B fingered as XOO OOO doesn't speak easily, and when blown strongly enough to get it to sound, it's sharp. It also has a strident, unstable tone. Previously on this thread, TomGlos suggested using XOX XXX for high B instead. I agree; that fingering gives a much nicer-toned high B that speaks at ET pitch with a slight push.

On to cross-fingerings, half-holings, and extended high range. I'll begin by saying that I'm always keeping an eye out for low whistles that are agreeable to playing in a variety of keys, including outside the familiar 1 and 2 sharps. This is why I prefer whistles tuned to ET, and this is why I prefer low whistles with reliable cross-fingerings. In this area, the Optima is second only to my MK out of all the low whistles I've tried. XXO XXX, and a drop in breath pressure, gives a usable low G#, and XXO XOX gives a usable high G#, if a bit sharp. XOX XX/ gives a good low Bb. XOX OOO for high Bb is somewhat unstable; XXO XX/ has a clearer tone, but doesn't slur to and from other notes as readily. OXO XXX for low Cnat is just a hair sharper than OXX OOO, and has a clearer, more expressive tone that I like. OXO XXX for high Cnat is a hair flat. OXO XOX is unstable and a little sharp. OXO XX/ works best. OOO OOO for high C# is unstable, but OOO XXX works quite well, at roughly ET pitch. For 3rd octave D, OXX OOO is sharp and unstable, OXX XXX and XXX XXX are very sharp, and XXX OOO doesn't want to break up from high G. /XX OOO works very well, and you can control the degree of shading on T1 to fine-tune. OXX OOX and a strong blow give a nice 3rd octave D#/Eb, should you ever need one. XX/ XXO works for 3rd octave E; XXO XXO is sharp and strident. All the half-holings work too, although the D#/Ebs and the low Fnat have a tendency to buzz if pushed, like on many low whistles.

In summing up, I think that the Optima is a very nice low D for the price, and a good instrument for someone looking to transition from high whistle to low. I'm going to consider buying one myself, the next time they're on sale, as a backpack/campfire/car whistle. Good stuff. Thanks, retired. Thanks, Phil!

[cboody]

The Optima arrived here yesterday, but I had a concert to conduct and haven't had much time to spend with it. I hope to give it a week to get played so I am reviewing the whistle and not my discomforts and then send it on. My first impressions are mixed: Less air than an old Kerry I have. Uneven volumes low (soft) to high (loud). A bit demanding about air for the octave shifts (and I'm a trumpet player in another life so this seems unusual). I've a hard time with the finger placement on the right hand even though I play piper's grip normally. The bottom hole (E) seems a bit hard to reach. I suspect that is just my adjustment from the whistles I normally play. I'll check intonation and other things during the week. At the moment, though it is a reasonable inexpensive whistle, I would not want one. It doesn't seem to come up to the two I usually play (MK (pre Kelpie) and Copeland).

I've had little chance to play many of Phil's instruments and really appreciate the chance. Thank you Phil.

Chuck Boody

[cboody]

I sent the Optima on today. There was never a chance to play it in a group, so these opinions are based on playing at home and by myself.

I don't like the red head, but that really isn't an issue since other colors are available. Other than that I think the design and look of the whistle is very nice. And, given the aluminium ti will stay looking that way. Somebody called it ugly, but I do not agree.

The finger spacing on the lower hand requires a bit more stretch between B2 and B3 than do my other instruments. So, I found it a bit problematic to play quick tunes. I couldn't trust my lower hand to cover accurately. That, I think, is just an issue with time on the instrument. A week wasn't really enough to get the hand position of my other instruments to stop being the habit.

Air usage was more than reasonable, and long phrases can be well sustained (except above G...see below)

I found the bell note very soft and rather easily overblown into a sort of combination of the lower and upper octave notes. I could get a satisfying "honk" out of the low D, but only if I isolated the note and worked at it. If I took the time and played very slow tunes though it would speak decently. On a jig or reel it was useless or produced that double octave "squeal." I think this problem was related to my difficulty with the spacing of the lower hand. After some fooling around I discovered that, for whatever reasons, my lowest two fingers on the low hand tended to end up with the hole under the finger joint rather than under one of the soft areas between joints. I could not seem to avoid that, and suspect that it is a matter of my particular hand and method of holding things and how that matches up with t he instrument. I can say that I do not have the issue on my other instruments.

I didn't check intonation with a tuner, but found the instrument very acceptable to my ear. OXXOOO seemed OK but OXXOXX seemed better for the third space C. Those added fingers might be because I seem to prefer a slightly lower C than ET.

Given my issues with lower hand I'm a bit reluctant to report on evenness of sound and/or volume, so keep that in mind. I found the instrument very soft in the lowest part of the range and growing gradually louder as one went up the range. That is common to many whistles, but it is something I don't like. It is not so much of an issue with the MK and Copeland that I usually play. Over volume seems soft; not excessively so, but enough so that it might not be a good session instrument. Tone quality was pleasing but not exceptionally different in any way. I found it sort of between the "cosmic drainpipe" sound folks here have described and a smooth mellow tone I would associate with minimal overtones. To me the sound represents a good compromise, and one that many players may be very happy with.

As noted by others playing above G in the second octave will take some work. Quite a lot of pressure is needed to get the notes to speak well. If one did not push hard enough the sound was of a combination of the two octaves and not very satisfying.

Flexibility: For me it took a significant push to get the shifts from the first to second octave to happen well. This is unusual for me, since I've been a trumpet player and tend to overflow much too much on whistles. Perhaps I'm finally learning the right approach and this whistle just requires a bit more push. I hope so

In sum I think this instrument would satisfy many players looking for a good relatively inexpensive gateway into low whistle playing. But it has, as all whistles do, idiosyncrasies. I would not recommend anyone buy this blind. You might find finger placement an issue or that the middle of the road tone color dissatisfied you, or that you really want more volume. But do try it. It is a well made instrument in the tradition of the Overton/Chieften instruments, and is often available at a very reasonable price.

Thanks again to retired and to Phil for getting this instrument onto a tour. I was happy for the chance to play it and look forward to the Kerry Pro whenever it comes this way.

[ancientfifer]

Quick Update: I received the Optima this weekend and will be sending along in a day, and then posting a review.
Russ