Chieftain V3 low D mod contemplated

[wizzywig]

I would send it back to the maker and let him assess the whistle. he may replace it, all Chieftains carry a lifetime warranty regardless of where or who they came from.
wiz

[ubizmo]

I would send it back to the maker and let him assess the whistle. he may replace it, all Chieftains carry a lifetime warranty regardless of where or who they came from.
wiz

As I read it, the lifetime warranty is a warranty against damage. This whistle isn't, as far as I know damaged or defective. I can't really tell without comparing it to another of the same model. But you're absolutely right to suggest that I should probably contact Phil Hardy and see what he has to say about it, and whether he thinks shortening the beak would accomplish anything. He might even be willing to do it. Or it may just be that the whistle isn't a good fit for me.

Really, a great deal of WhOAD is the result of trying to find a good fit between player and whistle. The plastic head Kerry was my first low D. It had a great sound but so little back pressure that the 2nd octave simply drained my lungs too fast. My 2nd low D is a Dixon aluminum, which is really pretty good, especially in the 2nd octave. It has low back pressure, but more than the Kerry. The bottom of the 1st octave is a bit fragile. The Chieftain V3 has much more back pressure than either, to the point where the whistle fights me on the top notes. I do play the tenor (and soprano!) sax, so I know what it means to blow to get high notes. I don't mind doing that, but I like the notes to ring out in response. Probably a good fit for me would be a whistle somewhere in between the Dixon and the Chieftain, in terms of back pressure and clarity of timbre. I have a Howard coming in the mail soon, and that might be just the ticket (I'm not sure whether it has the newest head, however). I certainly won't consider hacking the Chieftain until I see how I like the Howard. If I prefer the Howard, I'll just sell the Chieftain.

I want to emphasize that I'm not considering a sawed-off Chieftain just because the back pressure is annoying in itself, but because I think it compromises the whistle musically. I want the top end notes to sound a certain way, and they just don't.

Ubizmo

[hans]

I want to emphasize that I'm not considering a sawed-off Chieftain just because the back pressure is annoying in itself, but because I think it compromises the whistle musically. I want the top end notes to sound a certain way, and they just don't.

Sounds to me it is not just a question of back pressure/ airflow resistance, but that there are other factors involved. But hard to tell without trying it. I say that because you mention particularly problems with the high notes, and from what you say the windway is not that narrow (1.2mm).

[Sigurthr]

That makes me wonder, how are the bell notes on yours? Maybe we should just swap haha!


Also; I had another mod in mind for my V3. I have a very hard time reaching Hole 6 with R3, and my finger spread is not wide enough that I can piper that finger. I have no problems on Low D Flute though because it is transverse. So...

Transverse Low Whistle!
If only I still had shop access I could do this myself; it's handy being a welder. Alas, unemployment is my bane.

I can't see how that works. I am not an expert on whistle making,, but I can do 'visual geometry'. You will not get the top of each half (fipple window and tone holes) facing in the same direction. The only way to get the tone holes and fipple window on the same side would be to remove a 90 degree section. That would change the pitch and the relationships between the notes.

Yes the mouthpiece would be upside-down, but that isn't of much consequence to me, and moisture would just flow/fall out!

I'm not sure an offset Hole 6 would help at all, the issue isn't with finger-pad reach but overall spacing between fingers, my R3 just isn't far enough away from R2/R1. When I go to use it I often wind up leaking from R1 because my hand has to shift down.

If anyone knows of any whistles that come this way similar that aren't badly out of tune, I'd love to hear about them.

@Ubizmo I seem to remember a DIY whistle page, maybe ggwhistles, I can't remember where, that gave what each dimension's effect on the playability and tone was. It could be a good guide to verify what could be causing the problems you are having.

[ubizmo]

For the record, I've contacted Phil Hardy, who will have a look at it and see if he can find anything problematic. So the hacksaw goes back into the holster, for now.

Ubizmo

[syn whistles]

[quote="hansSounds to me it is not just a question of back pressure/ airflow resistance, but that there are other factors involved. But hard to tell without trying it. [/quote]
You're right there hans, it's all a matter of balance, change one thing and you change another. You won't know what's going to change until you've done it!

[ubizmo]

An unfortunate update to this post. I did send the Chieftain V3 low D back to Phil Hardy, on September 27. As of today, October 18, it hasn't arrived. I was foolish enough not to get any tracking on it, so that's that.

Ubizmo

[ubizmo]

Final update.

The Chieftain V3 low D got stuck in customs. At any rate, Phil sent me a new one. This one is quite different from the one that I contemplated modifying, at the start of this thread. Although there is the expected level of back pressure, there is no problem at all playing the top end of the 2nd octave, all the way up to third D. The high notes above G do not feel obstructed nor do they sound muffled, as they did in the other V3. The overall sound of the whistle is the same--that soft "Stan Getz" timbre that I like--but in playability the replacement whistle is a huge improvement.

Ubizmo

[Clarinetcat]

Final update.

The Chieftain V3 low D got stuck in customs. At any rate, Phil sent me a new one. This one is quite different from the one that I contemplated modifying, at the start of this thread. Although there is the expected level of back pressure, there is no problem at all playing the top end of the 2nd octave, all the way up to third D. The high notes above G do not feel obstructed nor do they sound muffled, as they did in the other V3. The overall sound of the whistle is the same--that soft "Stan Getz" timbre that I like--but in playability the replacement whistle is a huge improvement.

Ubizmo

Wow... he sent you a brand new whistle?!?

Where is the applaud smiley for Phil?!?

[Mr.Gumby]

Where is the applaud smiley for Phil?!?

I think you'll find that got somehow mislaid years ago.

[Clarinetcat]

Where is the applaud smiley for Phil?!?

I think you'll find that got somehow mislaid years ago.

The actual smiley, or the applause for the Phil?

Regardless...........

[Mr.Gumby]

I was only joking. Sort of.

I don't think it were the smileys that were lost though.

[Steve Bliven]

[krabben]

Weird. I've always felt like my chieftain tunable low D V3, compared to alot of other low whistles I've tried, required less air for those high notes.

[ubizmo]

Weird. I've always felt like my chieftain tunable low D V3, compared to alot of other low whistles I've tried, required less air for those high notes.

I think the first one that I had, which I returned, had something wrong with it. This new one is really a somewhat different beast. For one thing, there's slightly less back pressure throughout the range of the whistle, and a bit more volume. The high notes speak very easily--just as easily as the Dixon low D that I owned, and more easily than the Howard. There is the expected trade-off, of course. With the reduced back pressure, I can't hold notes as long, particularly in the second octave, as I could with the first V3. But it's not nearly as bad as the budget Kerry that was my first low D.

In short, this Chieftain V3 low D strikes a pretty good balance between volume, back pressure, and playability, and I no longer feel the urge to go hunting for another low D.

Ubizmo