WTB: Lon Dubh

[Loren]

No luck with my Silkstone request, so let’s try something else….

Looking for a Lon Dubh in Delrin, or possibly a non-allergic wood like Maple, Boxwood, or Mopane, etc.

Give me a holler if you’ve got one, thanks!

[plunk111]

Sooo... I'm learning Irish and "Lon Dubh" means black lunch... I guess I don't get it!

Pat

P.S. Sorry, I don't have any black lunch whistles!

[an seanduine]

¨Blackbird¨
Google tells me it is the genitive singular for loin dhuibh.
Doesn´t sound any better if we put it in Latin: Turdus merula.

Bob

[plunk111]

That makes much more sense! Thanks! I haven’t finished the genitive lessons yet

[Nanohedron]

Black lunch: morcilla and tapenade on dark rye, plus an espresso with muscovado sugar. Doesn't sound half bad, actually.

Lon = blackbird; lón = lunch. The fada (acute accent), which indicates a change in pronunciation, makes a difference. Which is much of the time.

[Byll]

Loren: A number of years ago, a dear English friend died. She was a member of this board, and was known as Devon Dancer. Some time after her passing, her orthopedic neurosurgeon sent her black Lon Dubh C whistle to me. Pat O'Dwyer, Lon Dubh's creator, and I started a very active back-and-forth correspondence, to try to figure out the material it was made from, long distance. It certainly could have been African Blackwood, and for a long time, Pat was convinced that was the answer. Many photos ensued, and he finally came to the conclusion that the finger holes were not in in accordance with his Blackwood instruments, and he told me that the material definitely had to be acetal/Delrin.

The reason I have posted this, is that I thought that Pat's acetal whistles were relatively modern, as I saw them advertised, somewhere. I even thought I had heard the word 'plastic' used in describing them. Pat told me that for a short time, many years ago, he had made some whistles out of the black acetal material, probably 15 of them, at most. I love the C whistle, and carry it with me to every concert, as a beloved alternate, to my Sindt C.

With your extensive knowledge of whistledom, you probably already knew that Pat made these few acetal instruments, long ago - and then began making something similar again, years later. I remember that the new ones were injection molded, and they may no longer be available. I have seen them for sale, used, on the Irish Flute Store website.

Anyway, I hope you are successful in finding the Lon Dubh that you are looking for.

[Mr.Gumby]

I remember that the new ones were injection molded, and they may no longer be available. I have seen them for sale, used, on the Irish Flute Store website.

I believe the IFS instigated or at least encouraged the production of the plastic injection moulded Lon Dubh. I don't think they were much of a success though. They were available for only a short while.
I saw a display of them in 2014 or so and had a mind of getting one to see what the fuss was about. I tried a few in their shop and they were alright, easy to play, nimble and responsive, but the whistle had something distinctly plasticky about it, both in tone and 'feel'. I eventually decided I wasn't willing to lay down 70 or 80 euro for one although I would probably have given it a shot at half that price.

[Loren]

Byll,

Wonderful story, thank you for sharing it. I do remember Devon Dancer and recall being sad to learn of her passing when it was reported here on the forum. It’s nice to know that one of her instruments made it to you, and that it is cherished.

I was aware that Pat had made some Delrin whistles around the time they were first becoming known on the forum, and perhaps for a bit after that, but I had no idea how many of them were produced. I was also completely unaware that he even produced any whistles in C, so thanks for that as well. I’d love to find one of his C whistles.

It wasn’t until recently that I learned of the later injection molded Lon Dubs, as I was out of the loop a bit I think when they originally came out. I believe Pat states that these later (last??) Lon Dubs were made from ABS, and doing some research I saw the reviews were quite mixed. They don’t seem to have lasted long at all, and appears Pat maybe quit making whistles not long after? If so, that’s a shame, but whistle makers do tend to come and go.

Peter,

I did recently find a thread containing your (and others’) thoughts on the injection molded Lon Dubs, and found it interesting reading. Seemed like a good idea, but hard to tell from the limited and varied responses quite why the project didn’t work out. Though I must admit, as someone who made recorders, I was very surprised to hear that at least some of the injection molded Lon Dubs maybe didn’t have a chamfer on the block end, which really is critical. Some folks seem to have taken to correcting this fault on their own, with predictably good results.

One wonders if just a little more hand finishing would have made a significant difference in sales of the injection molded Lon Dubs, or would price have always been the stumbling block? Having never played any Lon Dubh whistle, I certainly couldn’t begin to say. I wonder what those who have played both the original hand made whistles as well as the injection molded versions think, particularly in hindsight.

[Byll]

Loren: A comment in your post, made me think that I had made an error in my own post. I checked it, and indeed I did. Ah, the varies of old age...

Yes, Lesley's doctor did gift me the acetal Lon Dubh whistle, but it is a D, not a C. I was also gifted from Lesely, an O'Riordan C - also black, like the Lon Dubh, and it is that whistle that joins me onstage, for concerts. The Lon Dubh is kept in the recording studio, and is played there, quite often. Your comment that set me considering all of this, was that you did not think that Pat O'Dwyer made an acetal C whistle. You are probably correct, Sir.

I apologize for any confusion I caused. Never get old, Loren...

[Loren]

No worries at all Byll, and thanks for the clarification/correction. Saves me from hunting snipe!

As far as not getting old, afraid it’s too late for that now, certainly if my own memory is any measure.

I’m curious Byll, where would you say your Lon Dubh falls on the volume spectrum when compared to other whistles you’ve owned/played? I’ve read varying reports on the topic.

[Byll]

Heh. Heh. Yes, quite. One definitely can waste a fair amount of time, hunting snipe...

If I run a high D volume continuum from a narrow bore whitecap whistle created by Mack Hoover, to a conical D whistle created by Michael Copeland, this would cover my entire high D whistle experience, concerning loudness. Loudness is subjective, and I have never used studio gear to check decibel levels on any whistle. I would say that my Lon Dubh D is at the middle of the herd. It can be heard quite well, when used acoustically with other instruments - and is truly not over or underwhelming. Its tone quality contains just a bit of complexity, but not too much.

For what it is worth, in the band, I play high Ds by John Sindt and Paul Busman (Dymondwood), low D by the good people at Howard (using their Reed mouthpiece), high Cs by John Sindt and Pat O'Riordan, a high E by John Sindt, and a low F by MK. Yep. I lean toward whistles made by John.

[Loren]

Thanks for that, gives me a pretty good idea of the volume of your Lon Dubh.

I always liked the sound and response of the Sindts, had them in several keys at one point. That said, I never completely reconciled with the fore/aft weight balance and the need to half hole the cnat, so I ended up passing them on during hard times, along with nearly every other whistle I owned, including my O’Riordans. The only whistles spared were my Colin Goldie whistles and my Abell Madagascar Rosewood C/D/Eb set that I can’t (safely) play at this point due to my allergies, which is a terrible tragedy because they are my all time favorite soprano whistles. But hey, first world problems…..

Thanks again for taking the time offer some info and insight on the Lon Dubs, much appreciated!

[Byll]

I find it interesting that you sold your O'Riordans, Loren. I really respect Pat and his work. Such an incredible man. I had many phone conversations with him, and we joked about his designing a second - larger bore - low D - which never happened. His death hurt a lot. I learned of it from his daughter.

I am one of those collitsch edjucated classical music pro musicians, who decide to take on whistles, later in life. Thought I could handle a tube and six holes. Heh. Heh. I was put in my place, quite often, till I got the proper instruction, followed by lots of work, on my part... I am still taking lessons, and still have a lot to learn.

I bought many whistles at that time, and played them all. I met some absolutely fascinating whistle smiths. A lot of years later, I discovered John Sindt, and began to sell a whole lot of unused whistles. By this time, Pat had passed, and I noted that I played better, musically, on John's instruments than on any other. Like you, I eventually sold my O'Riordans - to a gentleman from Japan - all except for the C Traveler, from Devon Dancer. Memories...

A quick aside: One whistle maker who used to be on this board, was known here as Feadoggie. We conversed via email, a lot - with some memorable lengthy discussions about Sindt whistles and their... uh... many similarities to offerings from other brands. His emails ceased awhile back, and he no longer is on the board. If you know anything about his current status, I would appreciate knowing...

My best, Sir.

[Loren]

I won’t hold your classical background against you: My grandmother was a classical piano teacher of some note here in the states. I grew up listening to prodigies hammering out Chopin and the like on the baby grand in my grandparents’ living room - usually on weekend mornings not long after sunrise, the row house neighbors must have loved it nearly as much as I did

I only had 2 or 3 O’Riordans, IIRC. Didn’t want to sell them, but money was tight and my German Shepherd was starting to look at me like I might be his next meal if I didn’t keep the kibble coming……

I was wondering about feadoggie myself, no idea what happened to him and hope he’s ok. Many of the members from way back have gone and one wonders about their health. But of course many people just drift away or purposely move on, which is understandable. In recent years I’ve needed long breaks away from the forums myself. At any rate, I bet someone has knowledge of feadoggie’s status and may inform, either publicly or privately. Let’s hope so anyway.

Enjoy your Sunday!