It is currently Thu Aug 13, 2020 6:08 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 31 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:11 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
Posts: 4639
Location: WV to the OC
Yes, as you say, transposing instruments.

The strange thing (perhaps) to someone coming from the 'legit' musical world, orchestral and pop and jazz, is that it's not the C whistle that's the Concert Pitch whistle, but the D whistle.

So, a Sax is named by the pitch you get when you finger thus oxo ooo

and a clarinet is named by the pitch you get when you finger thus xxx ooo

and a Boehm flute is named by the pitch you get when you finger thus xxx xxxx

but Irish flutes and whistles are named by the pitch you get when you finger thus xxx xxx

It's really arbitrary as you can see.

It's something to keep in mind, that an Irish D whistle or flute is a Concert Pitch instrument and in fact has the same notes and fingerings (mostly) as a Boehm flute in C, a Melody Sax in C, and a clarinet in G (they make them, they're big https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImMHOFb-dxY

xxx xxx is D
xxx xxo is E
xxx ooo is G
xxo ooo is A
xoo ooo is B

Same fingerings, same notes, just different naming systems.

_________________
Richard Cook
1978 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:08 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
pancelticpiper wrote:
It's something to keep in mind, that [b]an Irish D whistle or flute is a Concert Pitch instrument


Not quite true, I don't believe. They still transpose, but on the octave - much like the guitar, but the other way. I think the Low D is concert pitch, and plays exactly as written. I think I got that right...

BTW I have a bass clarinet. Now THAT'S big! If I sit on the sofa, with the clarinet sat on the floor, the mouthpiece is at eye level :o I have to sit on the stool (bench) at the keyboard to be high enough to get it in my pie hole. :D

Now that you mention it, the fingering on the whistle, is the same as the second register on the bass clarinet. That's useful for me to know. :thumbsup:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:23 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
... Oh, and I still need to learn "C fingering" so I can use the Bb whistle to play from the Bb clarinet songbook I have (I thought I was ordering a songbook for the bass, but messed up). Shouldn't be too tricky to learn both (I hope)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:51 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:47 am
Posts: 865
Location: Surrey/Hants border, England
I play my whistles & flutes as if they were 'C' instruments, why?, because I have other instruments & it's easier for me to think in 'C'. :)


Edit:
Quote:
concert pitch
an internationally agreed standard for the tuning of musical instruments, in which the note A above middle C has a frequency of 440 Hz.

_________________
Keith.
Trying to do justice to my various musical instruments.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:18 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
fatmac wrote:
I play my whistles & flutes as if they were 'C' instruments, why?, because I have other instruments & it's easier for me to think in 'C'. :)


Edit:
Quote:
concert pitch
an internationally agreed standard for the tuning of musical instruments, in which the note A above middle C has a frequency of 440 Hz.


So how do you make that work, Keith? Different genres of music, or use half-holing?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:42 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:47 am
Posts: 865
Location: Surrey/Hants border, England
Most of what I play is in the key of C, some in G, some in D, not many others keys, except maybe a Bb.

I cross finger mostly, but I'm not averse to half holing, if needs be.

Mainly old rock/pop tunes with some nice ballads, very little Trad Irish for me.

(I know these forums are mainly Trad Irish, but you don't have to play it.) ;)

_________________
Keith.
Trying to do justice to my various musical instruments.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:35 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:39 pm
Posts: 3053
Location: Kinlochleven
TheWanderer wrote:
If I played a G tune on a G whistle with G fingering, why would I run out of range?

Because G tunes don't necessarily sit between one G and the next like a simple scale (e.g. G A B C D E F# G), but more typically extend below and above (e.g. D E F# G A B C D E F# G A B), by which time you're looking at perfect D whistle range.

_________________
And we in dreams behold the Hebrides.

Why I teach... and where
Master of nine?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
Peter Duggan wrote:
TheWanderer wrote:
If I played a G tune on a G whistle with G fingering, why would I run out of range?

Because G tunes don't necessarily sit between one G and the next like a simple scale (e.g. G A B C D E F# G), but more typically extend below and above (e.g. D E F# G A B C D E F# G A B), by which time you're looking at perfect D whistle range.


Ahhh! That makes sense. Thank you, Peter.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 3:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
TheWanderer wrote:
fatmac wrote:
You can also tape over half of the blade hole to reduce the volume.


That makes life easy. Thanks Keith


I had to nip into town today anyway, so I picked up some blu-tack while I was there. I reckon that's less likely to leave a grotty residue. Gotta be worth 99p to not have irate neighbours banging on the door :D

Thanks again to everyone for their welcomes, insights, and advice. I look forward to learning more from you all :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:36 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
Quick nomenclature question:

Bell note - is that the lowest note on any given whistle?

I did a search, but couldn't find the answer.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 3:16 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:47 am
Posts: 865
Location: Surrey/Hants border, England
Yes, all holes closed.

_________________
Keith.
Trying to do justice to my various musical instruments.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 9:38 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
fatmac wrote:
Yes, all holes closed.


Brilliant! Thank you.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 7:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
Posts: 4639
Location: WV to the OC
TheWanderer wrote:
pancelticpiper wrote:
It's something to keep in mind, that [b]an Irish D whistle or flute is a Concert Pitch instrument


Not quite true, I don't believe. They still transpose, but on the octave


Good point, while the D Irish flute, D uilleann chanter, and Low D whistle are all Concert Pitch the High D whistle plays one octave higher.

_________________
Richard Cook
1978 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:50 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
pancelticpiper wrote:
TheWanderer wrote:
pancelticpiper wrote:
It's something to keep in mind, that [b]an Irish D whistle or flute is a Concert Pitch instrument


Not quite true, I don't believe. They still transpose, but on the octave


Good point, while the D Irish flute, D uilleann chanter, and Low D whistle are all Concert Pitch the High D whistle plays one octave higher.


Thanks Richard. I didn't know about the flute and chanter.

I must say, I am having fun with these two whistles. I don't expect to be amassing a great collection of them (I already have several other instruments), but there's a definite risk a low F and low D might join the array next year. :D


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
PostPosted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:28 pm
Posts: 35
I had a quick chat via email with Yasmin at Dixon's, about the difference in responsiveness of the two whistles. She suggested I try swapping the heads around, and see if the characteristics swap over too.

I took her advice, and the A whistle was just as lively as before. No significant change on the other either. After a little more playing around with the Bb, trying to figure out why I wasn't getting the same responsiveness, I discovered it's just a little more fussy over which angle the whistle is held at (or I'm naturally holding them slightly differently).

Once that's corrected, it becomes a lot more nimble.‎ So it was purely operator error after all, although they do both seem slightly better behaved with the heads on this way for some reason. That might just be my improved awareness though. Either way, problem solved! More than that, with a little angle and embouchure management, I can actually play "all fingers down" as loud, or even slightly louder, in the lower register than the upper, which will make for better dynamics. It's gonna take a little more work on my part to be consistent though.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 31 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google and 9 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
[ Time : 0.199s | 14 Queries | GZIP : On ]
(dh)