Mr.Gumby wrote:Not everything in Ireland has to do with the troubles.
And I realize that. But choppers and children? That's quite a dissonance, and one that made it all too natural to go there. In the bigger picture, the setting might have been any other place where you try to have a normal life although militarization is part of the backdrop. I'm sure we can all think of a few.
Mr.Gumby wrote:The video, however, was really about people, places and community. That's what I took away from it.
And that's what I neglected to glean from the vid as a whole. I was listening to the track strictly as a tone poem independent of the slideshow, which didn't really even register for me except as incidental - and for better or worse, a different movie unfolded in my head. In my defense, the album the track came from wouldn't have had the video, either. But such is art.
benhall.1 wrote:I got more of a Father Ted image, personally ...
"If you take music out of this world, you will have nothing but a ball of fire." - Balochi musician
Tell us something.: I'm a fiddler and, latterly, a fluter. I love the flute. I wish I'd always played it. I love the whistle as well. I'm blessed in having really lovely instruments for all of my musical interests.
Location: Unimportant island off the great mainland of Europe
Nanohedron wrote:And I realize that. But choppers and children? That's quite a dissonance
I think there might be some sort of cultural disconnect here. Where I live, which is rural, and the I think the same applies to rural Ireland, helicopters come over quite frequently. I have hardly ever seen a military one fly over here. Almost all of them are either medical helicopters or private ones. So there isn't the strong association with the military that you seem to have, Nano.
My understanding is that most of the helicopter traffic out in the West is An GARDA CÓSTA na hÉIREANN, the Republic´s Coast Guard, unless Michael O´Leary does a random flyby on his way to or from some of his properties.
Bob
Edited to add: they don´t seem troubled by those mysterious Black Unmarked Helicopters . . . .
Not everything you can count, counts. And not everything that counts, can be counted
The Expert's Mind has few possibilities.
The Beginner's mind has endless possibilities.
Shunryu Suzuki, Roshi
As I said above, it's mostly the coastguard search and rescue helicopter here. Your president's golfcourse gives us some traffic as well. In fact the son of a neighbour drives a helicopter and does sightseeing and taxi flights for them. For a while he parked the thing in front of the house or the field across the road, we got a lot of traffic of him going to and at some point. Other than that it's mostly quiet. We had a few busy spots when king Covefefe of Nambia and his VP paid visited the golfcourse.
As I said in an earlier post, it's never good news when you see the coastguard helicopter out, saw it circling off the Cliffs of Moher while walking on Saturday afternoon.
When you see that, you know it's not good news, between the careless idiots and the desperate.
Tell us something.: Playing Scottish and Irish music in California for 45 years. These days many discussions are migrating to Facebook but I prefer the online chat forum format.
Here in Greater Los Angeles every TV News channel has their own helicopter that flies over the freeway grid during the morning and afternoon rush hours and reports on the traffic conditions.
These news helicopters are the harbingers of death, because if you hear several of them hovering overhead you know somebody has died, or there's one of our typical Friday afternoon Police pursuits.
Then there are the Police helicopters with the super-bright search lights that patrol at night looking for suspects.
Anyhow about the Fiach what I'm hearing is a straight 1234 rhythm. Yes in some bars there are triplets on the 1 and the 2.
What I find interesting are the old recordings where 9/8 can seem to shift from
1 2 3, 1 2 3, 1 2 3
to
1 2, 1 2, 1 2, 1 2 3.
Here, but also there's an Irish flute recording from the 1920s that does the same thing, I can't recall the name.
Thank you, Mr. G. for the article of News you cited. That and the co-ordinated rescue of some foreign exchange students stranded along the beach there last month highlight the challenges of providing life-guarding services in your waters. On a note closer to our interest in Traditional Music, it is my understanding that Tony Dixon served many years with one of the English life boat services.
Bob
Not everything you can count, counts. And not everything that counts, can be counted
The Expert's Mind has few possibilities.
The Beginner's mind has endless possibilities.
Shunryu Suzuki, Roshi
On a note closer to our interest in Traditional Music,
FWIW, the Doolin coastguard unit, active in the piece, counts several musicians among its members. At least one fairly handy with the low whistle. You may have heard of him.
Last edited by Mr.Gumby on Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Nanohedron wrote:And I realize that. But choppers and children? That's quite a dissonance
I think there might be some sort of cultural disconnect here. ... So there isn't the strong association with the military that you seem to have, Nano.
While I do find the auditory combination of helicopters and laughing children dissonant - there is nothing about a helicopter that lends itself to an idyll - I don't necessarily draw an automatic military association. For me it was in how the chopper was presented: the impression of distance being closed until the sound was close and looming. That is key to the story. If it wasn't military, then it would be a medical emergency close by, or the police, or the news, or a security matter. For me the bottom-line impression with that audio treatment is that occasionally things aren't altogether well, so the children at play are dissonant to that, as much as the close-approaching helicopter, with the unease and alarm its proximity generates, is dissonant to the carefree children. To me that's clearly indicative of composition, not happenstance. We know that Ó Riada likes to craft impressions through sound. If the helicopter had remained sounding thinner, as if it were far in the background, my impression would have been quite different; that would have simply been incidental ambient noise that told a different story, although I must admit that the interpretation of surveillance wouldn't be an entirely unreasonable one. One's predisposition to paranoia would have to dictate that; I merely observe possibilities. I have the firm impression that, artist that he is, Ó Riada didn't make these choices idly.
"If you take music out of this world, you will have nothing but a ball of fire." - Balochi musician
Living just a few miles from Sikorsky Aircraft and nearby Long Island Sound there is every occasion to hear helicopters flying overhead, testing, repairs, tune ups, celebratory flyovers. Locally here there are the medical emergencies with LifeStar, police searches, news traffic reporting, Coast Guard search and rescue so helicopters overhead seems normal. There is definitely a distinct sound among various types of helicopters civilian or military that is, whirlybirds, Chinooks, or Sea Stallions.
Mr.Gumby wrote:The son of a neighbour drives a helicopter and does sightseeing and taxi flights.
Could this be the intended association, rather than something ominous or alarming? Viewing the life of youth or the community as a visitor, from a height or distance? (Vertical physical distance being a metaphor for distance in time.)
Mr.Gumby wrote:The son of a neighbour drives a helicopter and does sightseeing and taxi flights.
Could this be the intended association, rather than something ominous or alarming? Viewing the life of youth or the community as a visitor, from a height or distance? (Vertical physical distance being a metaphor for distance in time.)
(A bit of a stretch, I'll grant you.)
Why not? That's the nature of art: a mirror. People bring different things to even something so clearly representational as the Mona Lisa. You'll notice the furor over her still goes on to this day. As to what Ó Riada intended, we'd have to ask him (and I think I'll draw the line there, now, having pestered him enough already). But most artists are more likely to say, "My conception is immaterial. What do YOU see?" They're usually more interested in that.
So I'm not about to say that what I get out of the chopper/child juxtaposition - a story of the bitter with the sweet - is "right". It is one valid interpretation among others, though. It's all in the eye of the beholder. Some people may register nothing at it; for me, it was strikingly rich in potential meaning.
Steve Bliven wrote:
Nanohedron wrote:....there is nothing about a helicopter that lends itself to an idyll -.....
Around here, Santa comes by helicopter. Of course, your thoughts might vary depending on how you think of Santa.
That ... sort of ... illustrates (unexpectedly) what I was saying. I think.
"If you take music out of this world, you will have nothing but a ball of fire." - Balochi musician
pancelticpiper wrote:Anyhow about the Fiach what I'm hearing is a straight 1234 rhythm. Yes in some bars there are triplets on the 1 and the 2.
(Assuming you meant the YouTube impressionistic art piece with the slideshow) Well, it's a comfort to know that I wasn't the only one. The prospect of getting my head examined just meant one more thing I'd rather put off...
"If you take music out of this world, you will have nothing but a ball of fire." - Balochi musician
Tell us something.: I'm a fiddler and, latterly, a fluter. I love the flute. I wish I'd always played it. I love the whistle as well. I'm blessed in having really lovely instruments for all of my musical interests.
Location: Unimportant island off the great mainland of Europe
pancelticpiper wrote:Anyhow about the Fiach what I'm hearing is a straight 1234 rhythm. Yes in some bars there are triplets on the 1 and the 2.
(Assuming you meant the YouTube impressionistic art piece with the slideshow) Well, it's a comfort to know that I wasn't the only one. The prospect of getting my head examined just meant one more thing I'd rather put off...
I don't get it. How anyone can hear anything other than a simple, slightly slow, jig rhythm is beyond me. Where on earth is the 1234???
Isn't the reality that jigs contain both of these rhythms? If you play a jig at a fair lick it's dead easy to step-hop to it. There is also, I think, a wider relationship between the way that jigs and hornpipes work, certainly when you start "swinging" and dotting hornpipes.
The 6/8 time signature gives us a clue to this surely? Maybe (speculation!) one of Ó Riada's intentions in this recording was to expose/explore some of that?
Edited to add: And that's without mentioning marches.
