It is currently Wed Oct 16, 2019 9:09 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 131 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
Author Message
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 2:38 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:29 pm
Posts: 438
Location: Somewhere between Here and There.
NicoMoreno wrote:
Right, what I mean is "the whistle can not be played chromatically without halfholing, and I take the position that halfholing invalidates chromaticity". Another way of putting it is "an instrument is chromatic when it can play all notes of the chromatic scale using a fingering that doesn't involve halfholing, bending, shading or similarly shaping notes".


Okay. I just add "keys" and "holes" to that list as well, because I find the underlying logic faulty. Whether it's keys, holes, forked fingering, shading, half-holing or overblowing (or underblowing), secondary vents or whatever: all of those are simply technologies and techniques applied to a simple tube with a notch in the top with the end purpose of getting notes out of it. How many notes one can get largely depends on one's musical culture. If one lives in a predominantly diatonic culture (which I gather is the case of ITM), then seven notes per octave in two maj / two min keys is all that's expected. If one lives in a predominantly chromatic culture (such as classical music), then twelve notes per octave in 12 maj / 12 min keys is what is expected. If one lives in a culture of quarter / microtonality, then perhaps they'll expect even more notes out of a whistle!

Quote:
I acknowledge that forked fingering is a bit of a grey area. Piano is clearly a chromatic instrument - each note exists, there's one key to press to achieve it. Boehm flute is more or less the same way (although certainly some keys are harder than others). A baroque flute, technically can be played chromatically, with forked fingerings (no halfholing), but there's also clearly keys that are more challenging to achieve, plus there's the whole not being tuned to equal temperament issue. A keyless irish / modern flute is *not* designed to play with cross fingerings (same as a whistle) and hence is not a chromatic instrument.


I concur regarding pianos. I'd also concur regarding reed basses. Both are one key ~ one note instruments. (Flutes are not one key / hole one note instruments.)

I think we'd both agree that violins and trombones and slide whistles are perachromatic; instruments where every conceivable note is obtainable within the instrument's range. (They go beyond chromaticity.)

It's just my contention that any instrument that can play ONLY a diatonic scale (like a toy xylophone or a toy piano with painted on black keys) is "diatonic by nature". By nature meaning it CAN NOT do other than play a diatonic scale. Any instrument that can play the twelve notes of the chromatic scale, by any means and any technique and any technology available to the player, is "chromatic by nature". The instrument may not be used that way ordinarily, and I admit this is the case with the whistle! The evidence simply weighs in favour of the latter.

_________________
-- A tin whistle a day keeps the racketts at bay.

-- WhOAD Survivor No. 11373


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 7:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:14 pm
Posts: 25
I have opted to start with one from Williamsburg because it came with 8 songs. Give me a break guys, I have to start somewhere. Ha Ha


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 7:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:29 pm
Posts: 438
Location: Somewhere between Here and There.
What1cand0 wrote:
I have opted to start with one from Williamsburg because it came with 8 songs. Give me a break guys, I have to start somewhere. Ha Ha


Ah, the famous Cooperman tin whistle...

Once set up, they're actually okay whistles!

Happy chifflating!

_________________
-- A tin whistle a day keeps the racketts at bay.

-- WhOAD Survivor No. 11373


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 5:53 pm 
Offline
Moderatorer
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 6:00 pm
Posts: 34620
Location: Minneapolis
whistlecollector wrote:
I think we'd both agree that violins and trombones and slide whistles are perachromatic; instruments where every conceivable note is obtainable within the instrument's range. (They go beyond chromaticity.)

AAARRGH. Can - no - longer - resist - pedantry ...

"Pera-" is to the best of my knowledge no prefix in English, so I assume by context that you meant "perichromatic" rather than "parachromatic". I would normally pronounce all three pretty much the same, so I get the reason for the spelling, but that's also the reason I can't be confident of your intended meaning; simply put, if I'm going to flame you I want it to be for the right reasons, dammit, not the wrong ones. :wink:

_________________
"Time is the wisest counselor of all." - Pericles

"I remain not entirely convinced of it." - Nano


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:59 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:47 am
Posts: 617
Location: Surrey/Hants border, England
What1cand0 wrote:
I have opted to start with one from Williamsburg because it came with 8 songs. Give me a break guys, I have to start somewhere. Ha Ha


The good thing is that you have started - the other whistles will come along shortly. :D :thumbsup:

_________________
Keith.
Trying to do justice to my various musical instruments.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 7:17 am 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 5:21 pm
Posts: 12524
Location: Unimportant island off the great mainland of Europe
Nanohedron wrote:
AAARRGH. Can - no - longer - resist - pedantry ...

Thanks. I resisted. But I'm grateful that you didn't. :)

_________________
"Only connect!"

https://youtu.be/ezbWVysJAOY
https://tapm.bandcamp.com/


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:56 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 1:40 pm
Posts: 98
Location: Arvada, Colorado USA
whistlecollector wrote:
Perhaps you can start up a "what's the best whistle out there" thread and can enjoy a whole nother fireworks show!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

_________________
Cheers!

Michael
Living the Rainbow Life!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:35 pm 
Offline
Moderatorer
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 6:00 pm
Posts: 34620
Location: Minneapolis
benhall.1 wrote:
Nanohedron wrote:
AAARRGH. Can - no - longer - resist - pedantry ...

Thanks. I resisted. But I'm grateful that you didn't. :)

Oh, I did resist. I did. It was the pebble in my shoe, the itch I dared not scratch; letting it be was an effort so monumental that even my teeth were sweating. But sometimes public service in the end outranks grace, so there you have it. Let the chips fall where they may.

_________________
"Time is the wisest counselor of all." - Pericles

"I remain not entirely convinced of it." - Nano


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 9:09 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:29 pm
Posts: 438
Location: Somewhere between Here and There.
Nanohedron wrote:
whistlecollector wrote:
I think we'd both agree that violins and trombones and slide whistles are perachromatic; instruments where every conceivable note is obtainable within the instrument's range. (They go beyond chromaticity.)


AAARRGH. Can - no - longer - resist - pedantry ...

"Pera-" is to the best of my knowledge no prefix in English, so I assume by context that you meant "perichromatic" rather than "parachromatic". I would normally pronounce all three pretty much the same, so I get the reason for the spelling, but that's also the reason I can't be confident of your intended meaning; simply put, if I'm going to flame you I want it to be for the right reasons, dammit, not the wrong ones. :wink:


Ah, no. I mean pera- (πέρα) -- "beyond (merely) chromatic".

peri-, (περί) definitely not. Concernting Chromaticity, good title for a book, though.

para-, (παρά) resembling, incorrect, no not that. Though parachromaticity, "defense against chromaticity" might be appropriate given the direction of the thread!

_________________
-- A tin whistle a day keeps the racketts at bay.

-- WhOAD Survivor No. 11373


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 11:30 am 
Offline
Moderatorer
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2002 6:00 pm
Posts: 34620
Location: Minneapolis
whistlecollector wrote:
Ah, no. I mean pera- (πέρα) -- "beyond (merely) chromatic".

I don't know why, but search as I might, I can't find this prefix. The closest I can come up with is "per-", which seems to fill roughly the same niche you describe.

_________________
"Time is the wisest counselor of all." - Pericles

"I remain not entirely convinced of it." - Nano


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tin penny whistle
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 7:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 2:59 pm
Posts: 970
Location: Southwestern Ontario
Nanohedron wrote:
whistlecollector wrote:
Ah, no. I mean pera- (πέρα) -- "beyond (merely) chromatic".

I don't know why, but search as I might, I can't find this prefix. The closest I can come up with is "per-", which seems to fill roughly the same niche you describe.
You know, the prefix in words like pera-mbulator, "beyond mbulator" ... er ... ummm ... never mind.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 131 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
[ Time : 0.149s | 11 Queries | GZIP : On ]
(dh)