Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
-
- Posts: 317
- Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:07 pm
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: I'm interested in the tin whistle as a hobby. I'm here mainly to get information on the playing qualities of various types of whistles.
- Location: Orange County, California
Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I got my regular Generations Bb this week and while I like the overall tone of that key, THIS off-the-shelf one is kinda funky.
Sooo, I am soliciting opinions on the Freeman tweaked Generation Bb or any other one UNDER $40. I'm soliciting recent opinions because the search terms I used gave me results that were about 7 + years old.
Edit:
Please indicate about when you got whichever Bb you are talking about.
Sooo, I am soliciting opinions on the Freeman tweaked Generation Bb or any other one UNDER $40. I'm soliciting recent opinions because the search terms I used gave me results that were about 7 + years old.
Edit:
Please indicate about when you got whichever Bb you are talking about.
Last edited by MichaelRS on Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Posts: 1306
- Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:40 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: I'm a historian and the author of "The Beat Cop:Chicago's Chief O'Neill and the Creation of Irish Music," published by the University of Chicago in 2022. I live in Arlington VA and play the flute sincerely but not well
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I have a freeman tweaked Bb. Its very stable and smooth playing. If I compare it to my Sindt A, just a half step lower, it has some of the same quality as the mellow dog, that is, smoothness at the expensive of nimbleness. It takes more air to drive. I just sat down and blew along with a Bb Blues backing track at 110 bpm and it's really fun for that. For fast Irish music it's maybe a bit sluggish. But there doesn't seem to be a lot of call for Irish music in Bb!
I think it's very good value for the money. My comments are from a not very good whistle player, so take that under consideration
I think it's very good value for the money. My comments are from a not very good whistle player, so take that under consideration
- pancelticpiper
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Playing Scottish and Irish music in California for 45 years.
These days many discussions are migrating to Facebook but I prefer the online chat forum format. - Location: WV to the OC
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I have a Freeman Generation Bb that is fantastic.
I know there are great off-the-shelf Generation Bb's out there- I've heard people play them, I've got chances to try them for a few minutes. But in 40 years of trying every (off the shelf) Generation Bb for sale I've never found a great one.
Until I got this Freeman. The tuning is spot on. The voicing is just how I like it, with extremely sweet high notes yet full low notes.
I made a B body for it, and an A body.
A couple years ago I bought a Sindt A/Bb/B set, one head three bodies. They were excellent but my Freeman Generation A/Bb/B set is better.
I know there are great off-the-shelf Generation Bb's out there- I've heard people play them, I've got chances to try them for a few minutes. But in 40 years of trying every (off the shelf) Generation Bb for sale I've never found a great one.
Until I got this Freeman. The tuning is spot on. The voicing is just how I like it, with extremely sweet high notes yet full low notes.
I made a B body for it, and an A body.
A couple years ago I bought a Sindt A/Bb/B set, one head three bodies. They were excellent but my Freeman Generation A/Bb/B set is better.
Richard Cook
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
- StevieJ
- Posts: 2189
- Joined: Thu May 17, 2001 6:00 pm
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Old hand, active in the early 2000s. Less active in recent years but still lurking from time to time.
- Location: Montreal
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I have a Freeman Bb, a Sindt Bb and some ridge/dimple Generation Bb models - 3 or 4 of them lying about somewhere.
The Sindt is very nice and will presumably last a century or two. It's a wee bit bland compared to the others but still very good. (Curiously, with the A tube on it doesn't sound so good - sort of feeble. A half-step seems to make a big difference with the same bore size - which is my theory as to why Generation Ebs are so great.)
My old Generation Bbs are all very good. One of them, a very dark blue colour nothing like the blue of the modern models, is the best of them all, just perfect, even after all these years. The Freeman is remarkably good too - almost as good as that dark blue Generation.
I am surprised that Richard has never found a good Generation Bb in 40 years. Now did I notice them going off about 20 years ago, which is probably the last time I tried one in a shop. I don't know what the current ones are like. But the ones from 40 years ago were very good, and I never came across a bad one.
A Colin Goldie Bb might well be a very good whistle to have. I do have an A by Colin that I find incredibly good and very powerful. A very different animal from a Generation-style whistle though, needing a different playing technique.
The Sindt is very nice and will presumably last a century or two. It's a wee bit bland compared to the others but still very good. (Curiously, with the A tube on it doesn't sound so good - sort of feeble. A half-step seems to make a big difference with the same bore size - which is my theory as to why Generation Ebs are so great.)
My old Generation Bbs are all very good. One of them, a very dark blue colour nothing like the blue of the modern models, is the best of them all, just perfect, even after all these years. The Freeman is remarkably good too - almost as good as that dark blue Generation.
I am surprised that Richard has never found a good Generation Bb in 40 years. Now did I notice them going off about 20 years ago, which is probably the last time I tried one in a shop. I don't know what the current ones are like. But the ones from 40 years ago were very good, and I never came across a bad one.
A Colin Goldie Bb might well be a very good whistle to have. I do have an A by Colin that I find incredibly good and very powerful. A very different animal from a Generation-style whistle though, needing a different playing technique.
-
- Posts: 317
- Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:07 pm
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: I'm interested in the tin whistle as a hobby. I'm here mainly to get information on the playing qualities of various types of whistles.
- Location: Orange County, California
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
PB+J wrote:I have a freeman tweaked Bb. Its very stable and smooth playing. If I compare it to my Sindt A, just a half step lower, it has some of the same quality as the mellow dog, that is, smoothness at the expensive of nimbleness. It takes more air to drive. I just sat down and blew along with a Bb Blues backing track at 110 bpm and it's really fun for that. For fast Irish music it's maybe a bit sluggish. But there doesn't seem to be a lot of call for Irish music in Bb!
I think it's very good value for the money. My comments are from a not very good whistle player, so take that under consideration
Thanks to you and everyone else who has commented so far.
I'm not so much the purest and kind of venture away from just traditional Irish music. I play a lot of what people might consider traditional bagpipe tunes (having been at that off and on for 20 years and failing miserably. although if somebody gave me a decent set of pipes tomorrow I have been known to be able to eke out a possible version of Amazing Grace on them and can probably do so again with a couple of weeks worth of getting used to them) but I tend to also go for some other types of songss well, like from the American Civil War where I mimic a Fife on the whistle. Or really any other tunes that interest me.
-
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:01 pm
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: In an effort to ease from lurker to forum member; I'm hoping that this elite gang of whistlers will help this very green player to advance to the next stage. My current stage is slightly below novice and is only permitted in the garage like the dog I am. Oh yah, not a robot.
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I'm curious about the differences in the new and old Bb Gens. I have a new one that plays pretty good and one with a dark blue head and I think the dimple that you are talking about. It's a bit finicky and quite "well used" but usually plays pretty well. I'm actually going to try the putty trick on it to try and cure a bit of a squak. Could also be the player.StevieJ wrote:I have a Freeman Bb, a Sindt Bb and some ridge/dimple Generation Bb models - 3 or 4 of them lying about somewhere.
My old Generation Bbs are all very good. One of them, a very dark blue colour nothing like the blue of the modern models, is the best of them all, just perfect, even after all these years. The Freeman is remarkably good too - almost as good as that dark blue Generation.
I play my whole Irish set in Bb and all my keys for that matter but they just don't work when anyone wants to join in. Jerry's alto A on the other hand...what a gem!!
-
- Posts: 1149
- Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:47 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Kickbiker - at over 70!
:lol:
....................................................................
....................................................................
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I have both Gens, brass & nickel, Bb & mine seem to be OK, (recent purchases).
(But I got a pre used Dixons Trad brass in A, & found that I liked that key more.)
(But I got a pre used Dixons Trad brass in A, & found that I liked that key more.)
Keith.
Trying to do justice to my various musical instruments.
Trying to do justice to my various musical instruments.
- pancelticpiper
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Playing Scottish and Irish music in California for 45 years.
These days many discussions are migrating to Facebook but I prefer the online chat forum format. - Location: WV to the OC
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
No I never did find a really good Generation Bb, and I tried piles of them in the late 1970s and all through the 1980s, dozens, maybe hundreds of them.StevieJ wrote:
I am surprised that Richard has never found a good Generation Bb in 40 years. Now did I notice them going off about 20 years ago...
I still have several old ones from back then in a drawer, the best ones I found. None are very good.
But my "very good" is based on my benchmark, the Generation C I bought back then, which is superb.
The Freeman Generation Bb is the first one I've owned that plays like that C.
I will add that recently I got several Generations from the estate of musician Keith MacNeil, including a Bb, which is better than any of my previous ones, though still not as good as the Freeman.
Another recent serendipitous find was getting a pile of old whistles from somebody. The prize there, which surprised me, is a Waltons C.
Last edited by pancelticpiper on Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:28 am, edited 5 times in total.
Richard Cook
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
- An Draighean
- Posts: 889
- Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:18 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 10
- Location: Parker County, Texas, USA
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
You need to be around more flat-set pipers and harpers.PB+J wrote:But there doesn't seem to be a lot of call for Irish music in Bb!
Deartháir don phaidir an port.
- pancelticpiper
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Playing Scottish and Irish music in California for 45 years.
These days many discussions are migrating to Facebook but I prefer the online chat forum format. - Location: WV to the OC
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
Do you mean the Scottish pipes? Or the uilleann pipes?MichaelRS wrote: I play a lot of what people might consider traditional bagpipe tunes (having been at that off and on for 20 years and failing miserably.
I don't think I've heard that done successfully, due to whistles being funky in the 3rd octave, where fife music dwells. But if you can get a great 3rd octave out of a whistle, more power to you.MichaelRS wrote: I mimic a Fife on the whistle.
Anyhow I'm in Orange County too and always up for getting together. I have nice Scottish smallpipes in A so if you're playing Highland pipe tunes on whistle we might have some shared tunes to play! And I get together sometimes with a fiddler and guitarist and we play the Highland pipe stuff as well as Irish stuff.
Richard Cook
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
- pancelticpiper
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Playing Scottish and Irish music in California for 45 years.
These days many discussions are migrating to Facebook but I prefer the online chat forum format. - Location: WV to the OC
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
With my Sindt A/Bb/B set all three played well, though true enough that the best was the middle, the Bb. It was quite superb.StevieJ wrote: The Sindt is very nice...Curiously, with the A tube on it doesn't sound so good - sort of feeble. A half-step seems to make a big difference with the same bore size...
It was more sophisticated, I suppose, than my self-made Freeman Generation A/Bb/B set, but the Freeman tuning, timbre, and 2nd octave responsiveness was better.
(I tried to put both of StevieJ's quotes in a single post, but this site kept automatically weirding out about it.)
Richard Cook
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
-
- Posts: 317
- Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:07 pm
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: I'm interested in the tin whistle as a hobby. I'm here mainly to get information on the playing qualities of various types of whistles.
- Location: Orange County, California
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
GHB. But I've been off it (rather my practice chanter) for a few years now.pancelticpiper wrote:Do you mean the Scottish pipes? Or the uilleann pipes?MichaelRS wrote: I play a lot of what people might consider traditional bagpipe tunes (having been at that off and on for 20 years and failing miserably.
I don't think I've heard that done successfully, due to whistles being funky in the 3rd octave, where fife music dwells. But if you can get a great 3rd octave out of a whistle, more power to you.MichaelRS wrote: I mimic a Fife on the whistle.
Anyhow I'm in Orange County too and always up for getting together. I have nice Scottish smallpipes in A so if you're playing Highland pipe tunes on whistle we might have some shared tunes to play! And I get together sometimes with a fiddler and guitarist and we play the Highland pipe stuff as well as Irish stuff.
And when I say I mimic the Fife, I meant the fingering to get the tune.
- pancelticpiper
- Posts: 5298
- Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:25 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Playing Scottish and Irish music in California for 45 years.
These days many discussions are migrating to Facebook but I prefer the online chat forum format. - Location: WV to the OC
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
Yes that's the rub, I don't think the fife's 3rd octave fingerings work all that well on whistles.MichaelRS wrote: when I say I mimic the Fife, I meant the fingering to get the tune.
Richard Cook
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
-
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:18 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: I play lots of instruments including several wind instruments like recorder and Native American flutes. I'm looking to expand my horizons and learn more about whistles, especially wooden ones.
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
I have a tweaked Generation Bb by Tommmy Dion that is very nice. I haven't posted it, but I'd sell for $25 shipped to U.S. or actual shipping anywhere. Nice whistle but I have too many now.
- Sedi
- Posts: 993
- Joined: Sun May 01, 2016 6:54 am
- antispam: No
- Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
- Tell us something.: Practice, practice, practice. You're never too old to learn.
Keep on fluting.
---u---o-o-o--o-o-o--
-----------------------
Re: Do you have a Freeman Generation Bb... or other?
True, some whistles don't work in the 3rd octave at all. Some do. I found this fingering chart to be rather useful:pancelticpiper wrote:Yes that's the rub, I don't think the fife's 3rd octave fingerings work all that well on whistles.MichaelRS wrote: when I say I mimic the Fife, I meant the fingering to get the tune.
https://www.wfg.woodwind.org/tinwhistle/tw_bas_3.html
Concerning the topic at hand. My standard, untweaked Generation Bb plays quite nice. Rather breathy sound but I like that.